Boys with "Warrior" gene more likely to join gangs?

[injest]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/livescience/20090605/sc_livescience/boyswithwarriorgenemorelikelytojoingangs

Boys who have a so-called "warrior gene" are more likely to join gangs and also more likely to be among the most violent members and to use weapons, a new study finds.


"While gangs typically have been regarded as a sociological phenomenon, our investigation shows that variants of a specific MAOA gene, known as a 'low-activity 3-repeat allele,' play a significant role," said biosocial criminologist Kevin M. Beaver of Florida State University.


In 2006, the controversial warrior gene was implicated in the violence of the indigenous Maori people in New Zealand, a claim that Maori leaders dismissed.


But it's no surprise that genes would be involved in aggression. Aggression is a primal emotion like many others, experts say, and like cooperation, it is part of human nature, something that's passed down genetically. And almost all mammals are aggressive in some way or another, said Craig Kennedy, professor of special education and pediatrics at Vanderbilt University in Tennessee, whose research last year suggested that humans crave violence just like they do sex, food or drugs.


"Previous research has linked low-activity MAOA variants to a wide range of antisocial, even violent, behavior, but our study confirms that these variants can predict gang membership," says Beaver, the Florida State researcher. "Moreover, we found that variants of this gene could distinguish gang members who were markedly more likely to behave violently and use weapons from members who were less likely to do either."


The MAOA gene affects levels of neurotransmitters such as dopamine and serotonin that are related to mood and behavior, and those variants that are related to violence are hereditary, according to a statement from the university.


The new study examined DNA data and lifestyle information drawn from more than 2,500 respondents to the National Longitudinal Study of Adolescent Health. Beaver and colleagues from Florida State, Iowa State and Saint Louis universities will detail their findings in a forthcoming issue of the journal Comprehensive Psychiatry.


A separate study at Brown University from earlier this year found that individuals with the warrior gene display higher levels of aggression in response to provocation.


Over networked computers, 78 test subjects were asked to cause physical pain to an opponent they believed had taken money from them by administering varying amounts of hot sauce. While the results were not dramatic, low-activity MAOA subjects displayed slightly higher levels of aggression overall, the researchers said.


The Brown University results, published in the journal Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences, support previous research suggesting that MAOA influences aggressive behavior, the scientists said.

[JudgeHolden]

A fancy way of saying, high testosterone, IMO. I bet if they studied soldiers or athletes they would find the same thing, but what you do in a test is not necessarily what you do in real life. Your upbringing, positive male role models, esp. a father or father figure like a coach all affect if boys like this become violent or learn to channel their natural aggressive tendencies in a positive way.

I watch a documentary on the Bloods and Crips (LA gangs) and the oldtimers, or the guys that lived long enough to become oldtimers, all recalled a certain gang leadre who united them and organized them, from what had been a collection of neighborhood thugs into a de facto army. One of them said that had this kids circumstances been different, he would of ended up in the military as a four-star-general. He was just a natural born leader and organizer.

Sad to think what might of been, had his gifts been put to better use, if there had been someone to see his talents and bring them out. The solutiuon to ganbanging isnt just more gang units, that to me is closing the barn door after the horse. These kids are obviously seeking a male tribe, they just dont know hoe to go about it.

trying and figure out a way to suppress male aggression is no solution either, its teaching boys how to control it and express it right. This isnt a social ill, its an essential part of the male chracter, it will always be around:


"Highwayman"

I was a highwayman. Along the coach roads I did ride
With sword and pistol by my side
Many a young maid lost her baubles to my trade
Many a soldier shed his lifeblood on my blade
The bastards hung me in the spring of twenty-five
But I am still alive.

I was a sailor. I was born upon the tide
And with the sea I did abide.
I sailed a schooner round the Horn to Mexico
I went aloft and furled the mainsail in a blow
And when the yards broke off they said that I got killed
But I am living still.

I was a dam builder across the river deep and wide
Where steel and water did collide
A place called Boulder on the wild Colorado
I slipped and fell into the wet concrete below
They buried me in that great tomb that knows no sound
But I am still around..I'll always be around..and around and around and
around and around

I fly a starship across the Universe divide
And when I reach the other side
I'll find a place to rest my spirit if I can
Perhaps I may become a highwayman again
Or I may simply be a single drop of rain
But I will remain
And I'll be back again, and again and again and again and again..

Johnny Cash

[injest]

I was thinking when I read the article that it completely missed this aspect of it, AJ, thank you for articulating it for me

to me, we are trying so hard to kill off the masculine aspect of humans...and oh would we miss it if we did.

it is as you say, a integral PART of being a boy...yesterday, a neighbor boy came thru riding his little dirt bike thru our place..he's about thirteen, does it quite a bit..no problem...

well yesterday, he decided he was going to 'jump' that motorbike off a little hill we have by the round pen; just showing off ya know, well Don had bought some fence posts and unloaded them there on the side of that hill. The boy didn't look, assumed the hill was clear...took off it and didn't catch the air on the BIKE as much as he planned, DID catch some nice air by HIMSELF when the bike hit those fence posts...

not sure but dont' THINK his leg is broken...(he's a country boy, made me laugh a little when he assured us he didn't think it was broke, broke hurts a lot worse and 'I got dirt in my eyes' to cover the tears...)

 

his momma was upset...but like Don told her...he's a boy. and sometimes, that is all the explanation you need. and there is nothing wrong with it. You just hope they survive til they are old enough to know better...

and in some cases, that is longer than others...(glancing at Brad)

 

[injest]

it bothered me that the entire article is so one sided...to me the 'warrior' gene is to be celebrated..and focused for the good of society..here are your police officers, your adventurers, your explorers..where would we be without them in our history? we have not advanced enough not to need them.

and the place would be boring without them.

[bradINblue]

One sided for sure. Equate high testosterone with criminal thugs. Come on. Thing is, in the black community, this makes sense to me. I spent a good deal of my career in that community, and seeing how most of these boys are raised and where the priorities are, the focus of ht/warrior stuff is drugs/gangs etc., because there isn't another option. I'm sure Milo could go into much detail regarding this. I believe, if military service was mandatory, many of these young men would have another option.

Brad

[JudgeHolden]

One sided for sure. Equate high testosterone with criminal thugs. Come on. Thing is, in the black community, this makes sense to me. I spent a good deal of my career in that community, and seeing how most of these boys are raised and where the priorities are, the focus of ht/warrior stuff is drugs/gangs etc., because there isn't another option. I'm sure Milo could go into much detail regarding this. I believe, if military service was mandatory, many of these young men would have another option.

Brad

Whats really sad about this is that these kids get to the age where one enlists, by that time they already got enough strikes against them to bar them from enlistment, such as a criminal record, or being a dropout, or in a custodial family situation (that tends to affect females more than males though the Army is cracking down on deadbeat parents).

Im not just talking ghetto black boys but pretty much ANY kid from the lower rungs of the societal ladder. Brad and I would rapidly run out of fingers and toes counting off the number of poor white country boys whose options in life are about zero before theyre even legally MEN, because of bad or absent parenting,alck of education, and adolescent stupidity.  Black kids may get more media attention because they problems associated with them are urban ones, and the media aere in urban areas.

But as I have said before, aside from skin color, were basically talking about the same people with the same issues. The parallels are as regular as railroad tracks: early parenthood, absent fathers, mothers or grandmothers trying and do the job of several people and no one to watch the kids, living in areas badly served byt he educational system,the need for a peer group without the monitoring and examples of responsible adults, leading them into trouble, all of which seriously narrow the path for them. Ghetto Detroit or Redneck Falls, Arkansas, its the same story.

And what really breaks your heart is that even if the planets line up alright for a kid from either place, the miltary is about the only shot they got thats a sure thing, you do not want to screw up ypur chances, and so many kids are so shorsighted, they dont think at 15 that dropping out means goodbye to any career path that will net them over 10 bucks an hour, that 2 drunk driving convictions by means the Army will probably not look at you.

The last few years with the Iraq situation, we were taking kids that would not of made the cut in the drawdown years, kids that could barely write their name, pathetic scores on the ASVAB, criminal convictions, the works, and that has led to a lot of headaches for thier NCOs, to say nothing of the situations like the kid that raped and murdered that Iraqi girl. he should never of been in the Army, and in better times, he wouldnt of been.

But at the same time, that second chance might be a life chance for many other kids, around positive male authority figures for maybe the first time in their lives, peers that are not a toxic influence, learning skills they can actually use, accomplishing something other than death-defying tags on the railroad bridge. Those are the stats you dont hear about, but maybe it is worth all the first seargeants and captains taking up smoking again after quitting for 15 years.

BTW, Bradford, you ever read "AWOL, the unexcused absence of Americas upper classes from the Armed Forces."

When Im dictator, we are bringing back the draft, boys and girls, no exceptions, Yes Sir.

[bradINblue]

When Im dictator, we are bringing back the draft, boys and girls, no exceptions, Yes Sir.

Well, bud, make me first officer, and I will carry out as planned. Sir.

Brad

[JudgeHolden]

Would you prefer the fancy getup with the gold braid and shit or the nice comfy BDUs? Now I think of it, having seen your grill setup, Ill just send an order to the Tactical Tailor for the BDUs in XL

[injest]

Would you prefer the fancy getup with the gold braid and shit or the nice comfy BDUs? Now I think of it, having seen your grill setup, Ill just send an order to the Tactical Tailor for the BDUs in XL

yep, Brad...you gonna be paying for the Dockers comment for a LONG time...

[injest]

But at the same time, that second chance might be a life chance for many other kids, around positive male authority figures for maybe the first time in their lives, peers that are not a toxic influence, learning skills they can actually use, accomplishing something other than death-defying tags on the railroad bridge. Those are the stats you dont hear about, but maybe it is worth all the first seargeants and captains taking up smoking again after quitting for 15 years.

BTW, Bradford, you ever read "AWOL, the unexcused absence of Americas upper classes from the Armed Forces."

When Im dictator, we are bringing back the draft, boys and girls, no exceptions, Yes Sir.

there is one of the biggest mistakes we have made as a society. telling ourselves that children dont REALLY need a man in their life...that a dad's role can be played by mom..

I realize that there are circumstances beyond a woman's control but the IDEAL situation for a child is a strong father figure and a loving mother...period. Are there great kids being raised by one or the other? sure. absolutely. but as a policy I think kids need both.

and the whole skills thing. It really irks me to see people trying to remove all competition from life...competition IS life. We fight every day...to be good at our job, to the best mate we can be...look at kids playing, the instinct to compete is bred IN us. At Bettermost, a member started a thread to thank other members when they did something nice or made a good point. Admin removed it because "someone whose name wasnt' mentioned might get their feelings hurt". 

so we cant' acknowledge people that are putting themselves out there and going above and beyond; cause a lazy selfish person might be upset. whatever.

And if you do have a competition, then people today want to make sure everyone gets a prize..well where is the incentive to push yourself? if you are getting the same thing as everyone else no matter if you stay home and eat bon bons or if you train three hours a day...you're likely to stay home.

if you give prizes to everyone, the prize means nothing. We are robbing both kids. The winner doesnt' get to feel his accomplishment or get the recognition he deserves...but we are also hurting the loser in the long run..because he knows he doesnt' deserve it and it tells him we expect no more from him.

[MagicM]

When Im dictator, we are bringing back the draft, boys and girls, no exceptions, Yes Sir.

Until that time there is always the French Foreign Legion.

Today’s 7699 men of the French Foreign Legion hail from a mind-boggling 136 different countries. Without a doubt, the Legion’s ferocious reputation on the battlefield plays a large part in its allure, strong traditions and attachments to the past also help form the unique ‘esprit de corps.’

Created in 1831 by Louis Phillipe, the Legion was composed exclusively of volunteers aged 18-40 ‘with or without means of identification’ and was immediately involved in Algeria’s conquest. Because of the unsavoury nature of jobs given to it, the Legion soon developed a name as the last chance saloon for every mercenary and criminal on the run who could get himself to France and sign up. This inevitably led to the romanticism and sense of adventure familiar to all who have seen films such as Beau Geste – full of honourable men, often love-lorn and seeking to escape the unfairness of life.

The promise of a life of discipline, empty deserts and anonymity still has a certain monastic appeal to those new recruits looking for a fresh start in the world, just with fewer prayers and a lot more guns and drinking. Nowadays, one of the few entry requirements is a valid ID card or passport; no-one need ever know your name or country of origin once you’re enlisted however. The ability to speak French isn’t even a pre-requisite to joining up but as no other language is allowed it’s a question of learning very quickly - swearing fluently is a highly prized skill.

http://www.creuse-news.com/french-foreign-legion

[Arcadianmemories]

Until that time there is always the French Foreign Legion.

Today’s 7699 men of the French Foreign Legion hail from a mind-boggling 136 different countries. Without a doubt, the Legion’s ferocious reputation on the battlefield plays a large part in its allure, strong traditions and attachments to the past also help form the unique ‘esprit de corps.’

Created in 1831 by Louis Phillipe, the Legion was composed exclusively of volunteers aged 18-40 ‘with or without means of identification’ and was immediately involved in Algeria’s conquest. Because of the unsavoury nature of jobs given to it, the Legion soon developed a name as the last chance saloon for every mercenary and criminal on the run who could get himself to France and sign up. This inevitably led to the romanticism and sense of adventure familiar to all who have seen films such as Beau Geste – full of honourable men, often love-lorn and seeking to escape the unfairness of life.

The promise of a life of discipline, empty deserts and anonymity still has a certain monastic appeal to those new recruits looking for a fresh start in the world, just with fewer prayers and a lot more guns and drinking. Nowadays, one of the few entry requirements is a valid ID card or passport; no-one need ever know your name or country of origin once you’re enlisted however. The ability to speak French isn’t even a pre-requisite to joining up but as no other language is allowed it’s a question of learning very quickly - swearing fluently is a highly prized skill.

http://www.creuse-news.com/french-foreign-legion

good old enrichez vous Louis Phillipe, my type of Bourbon, that and WT.